ORAL PATHOLOGIST IN FOCUS

The purpose of this page is to support my initiative of empowering oral pathologists through exploring new horizons. Hoping to dispel the gloom and despair among young colleagues who are unable to find employment with this series of interviews with oral pathologists following different career paths.

Dr Shruthi BS the  Oral Pathologist -Researcher

We often assume that the only path to a career in research is through a doctorate. In this interview with Dr Shruthi BS that misconception is cleared.

 

Watch the video, to find how she traversed the distance from academics to research and even continued teaching on her own, without the presumably essential post in a college. 

In this honest and no-frills interview, she describes her passion for oral pathology, the contribution of her oral pathology training made to her career in research, the need for publications and a desire to learn and a curious nature. 

DR PRATHIBHA PRASAD -ORAL PATHOLOGIST IN THE UAE

Watch the video on Youtube Channel  Mandana Donoghue 

 

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Interview Transcript - (edited) :

Dr Mandana -Hello, and welcome to this edition of oral pathologists in focus. I am Dr Mandana Donoghue and today with me, I have Dr Prathibha Prasad from the UAE. She has finished MDS, and she has also finished a PhD. And today she's going to share with us a little bit about how she got there. How is life there? And what are her next plans? So, welcome, Prathibha.

Dr Prathibha - Hi, madam. Good afternoon. Thank you for having me.

Dr Mandana  -Thank you for being here. It's great having you here. So, of course, in these times, the first thing I guess anybody would want to know is what's happening with COVID there? How is it affecting dentistry? How is it affecting life? And how is everything going on?

 Dr Prathibha - Yes. So Because of COVID, there is a fiscal downhill that's global and UAE is also one of the countries affected.

And coming to dentistry as such, I think clinical practice is hit worse compared to the university.

Because they're allowed to do only certain procedures and not all and most of the pay is based on commission. Okay, so, they are suffering a bit. Whereas universities are functioning fine, because, they've gone on a distance learning mode, and everything is going the normal way.

Dr Mandana  - So what is the dental course there? We have BDS here. What is the degree there? How many colleges are there? How many years is the course?

Dr Prathibha  - There are about five colleges, there's one in Dubai, which is dedicated only for master's program. And in northern Emirates, there are four colleges and most of them are teaching the BDS program.

But the University where I was working, they are teaching a program called DMD. It's a bachelor program. Name is  Doctor of Dental Medicine but it's not really a doctoral degree. It is a Bachelor degree similar to the US, like DMD and DDS. But it's for five years plus an internship.  Five years they graduate, internship is considered as a different program here.

The DMD program especially gives more clinical exposure the students even do implants and veneers, and even third molar extraction, so once they pass  they can have a very good practice. They don't really have to do a Masters unless they want to get into academics or they're passionate about pursuing something.

Mandana Donoghue  - What about the master's degree? What about oral path?

Dr Prathibha -Oral path? There is no masters in fact,

Master's program started just a few years back here and PhD started just one year back.

I think endodontics Oral Surgery and periodontics masters are offered. I don't know about others these three I'm sure that they're offered in our university as well as other university.

Mandana Donoghue  - So, how did you get there?

Dr Prathibha  - Okay. That's a very interesting story. I think destiny just brought me here. I came for a New Year celebration in 2010 Dubai, with friends and family.  I just wanted to see how it works here. And I just went around, met a few people who were common friends of my friends and I happened to give my CV and I got a call within a week actually. So since 2011, January, I'm here. So it's almost going to be 10 years. And it's been great. Actually, it's been fantastic. It's a great learning experience and, you know, to achieve certain amount of success and to be recognized outside your country is quite challenging. It's not easy. You have to push yourself and you have to think outside the box to have an edge over others.

Dr Mandana  - I recall that you are never really that heavily into research. Then what made you choose a PhD?

Dr Prathibha  - Actually, to be very frank, it was my only way to rise up the ladder.

But, When I came to UAE, what I saw was that people were very much into smoking shisha, hookah what we call in India, and all over the world it's called waterpipe smoking. So I was very curious. They have so many flavours and everybody from women to even like teenagers is into it. I don't know if it's cultural. 

So I wanted to do a study on that and that was my motivation. And my proposal was accepted. There was not much done on it at that time. This was like way, way back in 2012.  

In fact in the last three years, I have pursued molecular research with the world renowned scientists. There's a translational research centre and from each faculty, two doctors were chosen to work alongside this scientist. And I was one of them. And so I stepped it up a little bit. So whatever I did during my PhD, I took the same study topic, and I did it at a molecular level. So I grew the normal lung cells in three dimension spheroids and treated with the shisha extract at various concentrations and different time points. And I wanted to show different pathways, which basically show you that there is a early and late pre-malignant change in the normal lung cells when they’re treated with shisha. So this is a proper proof to show that this is happening. Whatever papers I have come across were all like case reports or just hypothesizing that this could happen based on you know, the GCMS showed in the shisha that was very interesting. We had to extract cDNA and do q PCR. So whatever we had studied in books, about fluorescence imaging confocal microscopy I got to do. So that was amazing.

And the head of this translational research is actually head of immunotherapy in the Cancer Institute in France. He comes here as a consultant and for him to approve my proposal and give a nod to go ahead itself was a big achievement. So now I'm a researcher and like research.

Dr Mandana  -  You know, the reason we are having this conversation is say oral pathology is the one pathway that can lead to multiple outcomes.

There's a whole world of possibilities out there so that our youngsters don't feel limited and don't feel any despair. Which is why I want them to know there’s so much that can happen so much that can be done? The world is beyond the colleges in India, there is a whole world of opportunities outside so that is why I wanted them to meet you. So let’s share with them a little bit about how you managed to go to the UAE?  Did you have to give any tests? How did you get there? Any other issues? Did they accept your degrees?

Dr Prathibha -Yes. So when I came in, degrees were accepted by the university. Later on, there was a process where my degrees were equalized.

But the biggest problem was getting a license. Here they do not recognize oral pathology as a speciality. And in all the labs, it's the general pathologists who report oral biopsies.

And I was very, very upset because I was a young mother when I pursued my master's and I went through a lot of challenges to finish it and I was not willing to take a GP license. So I wrote to the ministry and requested them and met them and then they agreed. The examination was conducted, by a general pathologist a microbiologist because our certificate say oral pathology and microbiology and an oral surgeon. So these three were the panel of examiners and it was quite elaborate exam. They gave me 10 slides to report in 60 minutes, followed by a Viva-voce. Microbiology was a little bit tricky because he was a general microbiologist.

But still, they were very kind enough to give me a specialist a license. Normally they don't give it to someone that young because I just had two years of post-MDS experience. But I performed so well that they gave me a specialist A license instead of specialist B. So that was another achievement.  

Dr Mandana - So is there now a possibility of an oral pathologist? You know, another oral pathologist, perhaps coming there?

Dr Prathibha - They stopped giving any licenses after that.

If they're coming here, they have few options

·       Either they can get their terminal degree, that's your doctoral degree and then join academics. But right now the scene is not so great I think it's all over the world and it's kind of getting saturated because UAE is a very small country.

·       And the second option actually,  I  guided a lot of my friends and juniors who approached me and it worked out fantastic for them, So what I guided them to do was to take up a GPL license and start practising. And many of them managed to get very good jobs in very good clinics after doing that, and they're very happy.

 Other options, is to work in a research lab like what I'm doing. So you can get trained, in the molecular biology and biochemistry and to do all the experiments and the essays, and probably you can get a job in the research lab. You can work as a research associate as well, so you can get paid and learn at the same time, but you have to be really good at it, you have to read a lot you have to be keen to learn. And you have to sacrifice a lot when it comes to timing like I remember I had to go to the lab like at odd hours, even in the middle of the night or early morning to collect cells. RNA isolation has to be done at a certain hour like after 12 hours; you cannot leave it for longer. So if you're ready to do that, if you're young and you know, you really don't have much of responsibility and you want to focus on career. AS oral pathologist, we have a niche because it's very easy to understand how the whole research thing works. All the pathways and signalling, and how to troubleshoot or how to even just read and analyse things. I think it's very easy for an oral pathologist compared to any other speciality in dentistry.

·        You can approach any pharmaceutical companies or any dental product's Companies; some require a dentist to be working alongside them. Recently I was approached by a company to study a new product and just give them the report. Basically, it's a marketing company. There are a lot of products which are coming in and all of them have to be researched. They have to see whether there is a need in the market to even release this product before they manufacture it in bulk. So they would need the help of someone who knows about the product rather than someone you who can just download some questionnaire.

 And if you're young, you can migrate, start planning now, don't delay too much. Because the younger you are, your score will be higher. So if you're younger, and if you have a minimum of three years’ experience, your score is amazing. And if you're single, it's even better. But if you're married, it also doesn't matter. Both your scores can be combined. But very important criteria is that you're below the age of 30

Dr Mandana  - Okay, another question for you,   I always keep telling youngsters that they need to be a little more on top of their social media presence on LinkedIn and research gate. What do you think? What is your experience? Do you think they would be helpful for them?

Dr Prathibha - Oh, it would be immensely helpful. Especially LinkedIn is garnering so much of praise, especially these days when there's the loss of jobs. And through the LinkedIn community, they're able to find jobs or contact people, you know. So, connections, grow your connections, keep connecting to people, there is no need to wait till you're in a certain position. That's too late. Actually, you should build your contacts and your second contacts. Make profiles look good have a good picture. Don't put some shady picture taken on your mobile, in silly poses. Take a very good professional picture and make your profile look nice, give correct details. Even if you miss something in your email or a phone number, the person cannot contact you. So remember that it should look nice. No one has the time to read every single word you've put in, but then make it catchy. Make it presentable.

Research gate as well, it's even better than LinkedIn because on research gate people know a little bit more about you academically, and you can easily connect to people and they answer all your questions. For me research gate was immensely helpful during my PhD as well as during my research because whatever doubts I had, I would just post to a scientist who's done the similar study, and they would respond. Research gate is a very big resource to clear your doubts or to even find papers which are not available; you can request the author to send it to you.

Dr Mandana  - It is easier to start your profile where you are still at the beginning of your career.  When you have 100 publications, it's difficult to load it into research gate. If you have started early on research gate after a point picks up your publications by itself. So you thankfully do not have to add.

Dr Prathibha  - And Google Scholar is another one that was something you told me to get into Google Scholar. I still remember

Dr Mandana  - One last question before I let you go. If you had the chance now to go back in time and talk to yourself, after finishing BDS, what would be your advice use it

Dr Prathibha - Oh, wow. I wouldn't have gotten married immediately because as soon as I finished my BDS I got married. 

Probably I would migrate in a younger age to a foreign country if I was given a choice, meaning not to Middle East because the disadvantage with working in countries like the Middle East I mean, UAE is a great country. But no matter how many years you stay here, you will not get citizenship. You'll never get a permanent residency. So if that is something you're looking for, then yeah, I would have migrated far earlier. As soon as I finished MDS probably.

Dr Mandana - Okay. But you'd still do oral pathology right?

Dr Prathibha  - I think I would have still taken oral pathology because at that point of time when I was applying for my Masters that was the only subject which was not saturated. And I was still in India. So yes, I would still have taken oral pathology because I'm more a practical person. And I wanted to have a balance. Work home balance since I was a mother. So yes, I would still have taken oral pathology.

But now when I go to Canada I want to move to clinical practice. Because I was very good at it and I used to love it and I miss it. Actually, I miss the interaction with the patients. I remember the patient who came for my prosthetics exam was a very old lady. Her treatment was finished in the morning, but she waited till evening for me to finish viva because she wanted me to go with her to her house and have food.

I'm telling I'll come maybe tomorrow or after I finish exams. I'll come to your house. She's like, No, no, no, no, I will wait for you and she sat there. There are many stories like this which touch my heart.

Dr Mandana - I don't know if you remember we had that case, of that young man with tuberculosis with the big ulcer, right on his face there was this through and through lesion. Oral Surgery at that moment was very definite that it is a malignancy, and they were actually going to excise but our biopsy showed that it was tuberculosis. They waited, and we could back it up with results and prove that it was tuberculosis. His jaw was saved, and he was treated with just antituberculosis drugs and he was fine. The whole thing healed. That really stayed with me.

Dr Prathibha  - I mean, you know, a cosmetic job is no equivalent to diagnosing a cancer at an early stage and saving a patient's life. I should apologize.

Dr Mandana - No, you don't have to apologize. It's perfectly fine. Clinical dentistry is as important. Finally, what are we doctors for? We are just doing different things. Think about the time when a patient's tooth with an abscess is just opened and that pain disappears. I don't think anything can give anybody more relief than that.

Dr Prathibha  - I guess.  Every job has its own importance. I feel so I think I'm lucky that in  this phase of life I am getting to go back to that, I would just say that.

Dr Mandana  - So, it's been lovely talking to you. And catching up and getting some insight for all your young colleagues, who will hopefully be doing much. It would be okay if people get in touch with you on LinkedIn. since you are on LinkedIn if anyone has any queries.

Dr Prathibha - All are welcome to connect with me and I will try to help as much as I can.

Dr Mandana - That's good. Yes. Okay. Lovely talking to you

Dr Prathibha - Thank you for having me on this. Talk and giving me this opportunity to do my bit and to give something back. Hopefully, with all the information I've provided the juniors can get whatever works for them. And I wish them all the best and to you madam.